Ok, so I had a few interesting 4bet pot hands in the last few days that I thought I would share.
A good opponent to 4bet light right off the bat?
I've noticed something in HU matches that is useful. We all know that if an opponent is decent, his first 3bet is light the vast majority of the time in a HU match. In fact I would say that the vast majority of reasonable opponents are 3betting you within the first 5 or 10 hands that you open. So against an unknown, should we be 4betting their first 3bet 100% of the time? Unfortunately, no. It's such an obvious spot to 4bet that we should expect to get played back at lighter than usual.
But I've realized that the guys that are perfect to 4bet right off the bat are the guys that make snap decisions. For example, if a guy is snap folding to a cbet, snap folding to a cr, snap folding to a 3bet, you can make a quick judgement that the player is probably somewhat nitty, is probably playing to the strength of his hands, and is not thinking too hard about alternate lines or even too worried about what you are up to. In other words the type of guy that reacts to a 4bet by thinking "oh shit this guy is a card rack, I fold".
Cbetting 100% of the time in 4bet pots (vs reasonable opponents)
xpertleagues: i think i'm going back to not playing at 2am when i'm tired and don't give a shit
friend: meh, if it's against a fish you'll be +EV even if you're drunk/ haven't slept in days
xpertleagues: yeah but i think there's something to be said for not having those "i played my C game" regrets the next morning :-)
kind of like waking up with a ugly chick or something
I was discussing this hand with him:
Poker Stars $3/$6 No Limit Hold'em - 2 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com
Hero (BTN/SB): $773.25
Pre Flop: ($9.00) Hero is BTN/SB with Q A
Hero raises to $12, BB raises to $48, Hero raises to $132, BB calls $84
Flop: ($264.00) T 7 9 (2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks
Turn: ($264.00) K (2 players)
BB bets $150, Hero raises to $641.25 all in
So my reasoning for my turn jam was that I can rep AK pretty well here, it's also very feasible that I jam AK for protection on this board with the amount already in the pot given how crazy the board is and knowing he can call with worse. Having said that, I think this was a tired 2am overaggro "I don't give a shit" move where I didn't consider strongly enough the fact that the reason it's OK to jam AK there is the very reason is bad to bluff there, you are getting called by alot of pair + draws.
But it got me to thinking about cbetting in 4bet pots. I actually think I should have cbet something like 130 on this board, and then jammed alot of turns. The reason I didn't cbet was that I thought I still had the best hand alot, and I thought I would get c/jammed on with alot of draws. But I think betting this board, and frankly nearly 100% of boards in 4bet pots has alot of merits:
a) Your range is crushing that of your opponent's.
b) You are getting an great price on your bluff
c) You will have a ton of good turn cards to jambo
d) When you jam the turn you are telling a consistent story and giving your opponent multiple chances to fold
d) It makes the hand ridic easy to play
This isn't rocket science, but I think I'm putting it out there mostly as a reminder to myself to stop checking flops in 4bet pots.
Cold 4betting a non polarized range when deep?
Wow, this hand really surprised me.
Absolute/UB Cereus No-Limit Hold'em, $4.00 BB (5 handed) - Absolute/UB Cereus Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
Hero (Button) ($797.50)
Preflop: Hero is Button with J, Q
UTG bets $8, 1 fold, Hero raises to $28, SB raises to $68, 2 folds, Hero calls $40
Flop: ($148) 8, 4, 8 (2 players)
SB bets $99, Hero calls $99
Turn: ($346) Q (2 players)
SB bets $175, Hero calls $175
River: ($696) 9 (2 players)
SB raises to $648.30 (All-In), Hero calls $455.50 (All-In)
Total pot: $1607 | Rake: $3
Hero mucked J, Q (two pair, Queens and eights).
SB had K, Q (two pair, Queens and eights).
Outcome: SB won $3208
This river is a fold, but I'm a (recovering) station and that will still talk myself into a call in some bad places. My thought process in this hand was that preflop his range was very polarized, given that I'm not a crazy 3bettor only 3betting about 6% of the time. I think in this hand that might have been mitigated by the small open, and then the small 3bet. But I would have expected any medium strength hands to basically flat my 3bet to go 3way with a fish. So by the river I thought he had 8x, AA, and KK, and bluffs exclusively and would put my range at basically middling pairs like 77/88/JJ that could never call a river bet. Or course like any addict recovering stations will talk themselves into all kinds of bullshit to justify their behavior.
BUT my point is that I found his 4bet interesting (despite some bad sizing imo), and think there is alot of merit to depolarizing cold 4bets since people generally play so straight forward in 4bet pots.