Weird spot deep vs goon

[beepokerking]

So first of all this hand hand comes up which makes me think hes very overly aggressive and maybe just pressing random buttons, besides that hes 3 betting 17%

Full Tilt, $0.25/$0.50 NL Hold'em Rush Poker Cash Game, 6 Players

BTN: $54.55
SB: $50
Hero (BB): $315.90
UTG: $54.60
MP: $51.25
CO: $50.50

Pre-Flop: J J dealt to Hero (BB)
3 folds, BTN raises to $1.75, SB calls $1.50, Hero raises to $7.50, BTN folds, SB raises to $49.75 and is All-In, Hero calls $42.50

Flop: ($101.75) 6 5 Q (2 Players - 1 is All-In)


Turn: ($101.75) 4 (2 Players - 1 is All-In)


River: ($101.75) A (2 Players - 1 is All-In)


Results: $101.75 Pot ($3 Rake)
SB showed K Q and WON $98.75 (+$49 NET)
Hero showed J J and LOST (-$49.50 NET)

And then this interesting spot comes up

Full Tilt, $0.25/$0.50 NL Hold'em Rush Poker Cash Game, 6 Players

CO: $53
BTN: $109.25
Hero (SB): $241.60
BB: $58.40
UTG: $155.90
MP: $210.05

Pre-Flop: J J dealt to Hero (SB)
UTG folds, MP raises to $1.75, CO calls $1.75, BTN calls $1.75, Hero raises to $8, BB calls $7.50, MP folds, CO calls $6.25, BTN raises to $29.75, Hero calls $21.75, 2 folds

Flop: ($77.25) 2 K K (2 Players)
Hero checks, BTN checks

Turn: ($77.25) 4 (2 Players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $37 ????

Considering hes 3 betting so much it really seemed like he shouldnt have a big hand, in addition he overcalls on the button. I thought he just never believes a squeeze and is spazzing out to it but then if he was bluffing i guess he would bet the flop. But im sure he would take a stab on the turn with some random hand

Every option seems a little gross

[klamsauce]

probably 5b AI and if he shows up w AA or something, I'd give his 3bs very little respect in the future.

Given original opener in MP is deep too I don't see his incentive to flat a monster and not try to build a pot preflop, especially with the wild image he obviously has.

It is close though because if he is just clicking buttons randomly, then I guess he can show up with a monster hand here just because he isn't thinking about his image, what he should be doing,he's just not thinking about much of anything. Using a level of reasoning that makes sense to us and applying it to his game could cost us 2 stacks here.

[bubsodian]

ship it pf probably call down now - if u call the 4b and fold now u probably should have folded pf- the reason u call is coz u think he will bluff hands post unless ur set mining which is terrible with these stacks call and call most rivers ace would be bad but he probably cant vbet that light so calling could be okay

[Macio]

I actuly would fold to a 4bet that deep with JJ. I don't feel like stacking off with JJ even versus very agressive player when 200 depp. He might play KQ in a wired way, buth when 200bbs deep i think he would play it different with trash.

This flop is very sick for you, and i can't think of any other play other then FOLD now. It might be weak but with this flop and knowing how happy he was to shove KQ, K is easly in his range and i wouldn't be surprised for it to be AK.

It hurts to fold when you put in that much but I preffer to just cut the losses in spot like this and if he bluffed then good for him, next time you have a monster and he will try to bluff you will get him.

Your hand now is a pure bluff chatcher and trying to catch bluffs for 200 bbs is not the way i play.

[T123]

use the convertor please. makes its soo much more prettier to read.

[Donktard]

Originally Posted by T123

use the converter correctly please. makes its soo much more easier to read.

+1....

[majorchom]

Originally Posted by Macio

I actuly would fold to a 4bet that deep with JJ. I don't feel like stacking off with JJ even versus very agressive player when 200 depp. He might play KQ in a wired way, buth when 200bbs deep i think he would play it different with trash.

This flop is very sick for you, and i can't think of any other play other then FOLD now. It might be weak but with this flop and knowing how happy he was to shove KQ, K is easly in his range and i wouldn't be surprised for it to be AK.

It hurts to fold when you put in that much but I preffer to just cut the losses in spot like this and if he bluffed then good for him, next time you have a monster and he will try to bluff you will get him.

Your hand now is a pure bluff chatcher and trying to catch bluffs for 200 bbs is not the way i play.

I agree with this, its a tough spot but based on the way he played the previous hand I would not be surprised to see him turn up with QK again or even AK as Macio said. His check on the flop also makes me suspicious. I'd like to see a few more stats on him namely C bet & AF but generally I would fold here.

[Probability]

I think we have to fold preflop.

[DRUK88]

I don't know, I think shipping it in may actually be best.

Reason I'm thinking is, yeah he seems terrible, but even terrible people know certain things. Say he has 55 there, he can flateasily, you squeeze, your range does not contain 66-99 (TT too probs), so if he can weight you more towards big As which he's ahead of, he may light a repop with 55 here.

However, depsite this, we don't have much history on how he thinks. All we have is that he is pretty terrible, so I guess we can assign him AA here because he's terrible. It just feels bad to fold because we have a good hand and he's terrible.

Is there not an argument for a flat pre? Simply because we are going to be OOP with a weird PSR and a lot of $ to risk, and as well, we are not likely taking this down ever pre, one or 2 are calling (the idiot definitely isn't folding).

[Macio]

it's only a JJ and at best you are flippig a coin. I don't like flipping the coin for 200bbs. If i only have one full stack then it's easy ship